We featured a video earlier in the week depicting “Dark Justice” intercepting a paedophile. 45-year-old Roger Lee was online looking for young girls to abuse and well… this fantastic lot pretended to be a girl and had him meet up with them and confronted him about it. All evidence was forwarded to the police and Roger is behind bars. Absolutely fabulous. We caught up with the group and they agreed to talk with us. Enjoy.
(Take a listen to the audio of the full interview below while reading through the text. Scroll through the interview on the slides below – use your keyboards arrow keys for navigation.)
Sick Chirpse: Thanks for having a chat with us today.
Dark Justice: Not a problem, not a problem.
SC: What area are you all from?
Dark Justice: We’re based in the UK in Newcastle upon Tyne and surrounding areas.
SC: What kind of industry do you work in for your normal day jobs?
Dark Justice: Pretty much IT and media.
SC: We featured an article on Sick Chirpse last week, showing a video of your team intercepting a sex predator. Can you explain the process that you go through that takes you to this point?
Dark Justice: It’s a very lengthy process normally, it starts off like chatting like normal. Plain chat just ‘how you doing?’ whatever. Then normally the person, the people we deal with, normally turns sexual. 9 times out of 10. That’s along how it goes really. Then they start grooming the child ‘we’ll buy you alcohol, do this, we’ll do that.’ So normally the child thinks this person is nice and stuff but little do they… like people who’s part of this know it’s actually just like fully grown people.
SC: So they pretend to be children to get children.
Dark Justice: No, they tell us their proper age sometimes, but sometimes they say they’re ten years younger or so when they could be thirty, when in fact they’re like 40 or whatever. But, ehh…we just gather information on them like evidence and stuff and when they suggest a meet after talking sexual and stuff, we just keep the evidence and we confront them face to face. Then we ring the police like five minutes before the confrontation.
SC: So you don’t actively seek paedophiles? You just kind of leave a bit a cheese out and they take the bait?
Dark Justice: They always instigate a conversation with us first and then in the first three messages we say for example like, someone called ‘Hey Liam, I’m actually only 14, here to make friends, find a car to school.’
SC: Sounds kind of like super heroes to me. Would you fancy yourselves as super heroes or something else? Vigilantes?
Dark Justice: I don’t really classify ourselves as vigilantes because if we were vigilantes it would be a lot worse behaviour and it wouldn’t be professional would it?
SC: So last I saw, your track record is 7 arrests. How does that make you feel? knowing that your work is putting sex criminals behind bars?
Dark Justice: It’s sort of overwhelming isn’t it? Because the police have actually taken it seriously and tackle this sort of crime.
SC: Just last year the UK’s N.C.A. (national crime agency) head made a statement saying that “it was not realistic” to prosecute some 50,000 paedophiles who have viewed child sex abuse pictures. Do you think that there needs to be more of an official effort to combat and stop these predators?
Dark Justice: Yes, certainly. If someone’s going to view child pornography why wouldn’t he go out and do that with a child if you get what I mean? They might potentially want to harm a child if they got the… in the first place why were they viewing the images? That’s the most interesting bit. Why are they viewing them images that could potentially harm a child?
SC: In the sense of trying to stop them, what kind of effort should be done do you think? More funding or just taking it more seriously?
Dark Justice: Well we don’t rely on funding or anything like that. We’re not funded along and we’ve even been offered donations. But we haven’t took any from higher people like chief executives and stuff of companies. It just needs to be taken seriously when your doing it a long time. Obviously you need time on your hands to get the evidence together and stuff like that.
SC: Back in 2012-2013 there are reports showing a staggering 23,000 sexual offences against children in the UK. What do you think goes through the minds of these types of people? Like have you any thoughts on what motivates them to abuse children?
Dark Justice: I’m not sure. I guess it’s just part of the brain that just thinks “Ah…” I don’t know really, cause I’m not really a psychiatrist or nothing. I’m not trained in that profession. I’ve seen things on TV and documentaries where it just they like the risk of being with children like underage. Like this risk of actually going out there and getting caught or whatever.
SC: So partially a thrill you think?
Dark Justice: Yeah, yeah. That’s what I think anyways.
SC: There has been a bit of a scandal recently when high profile establishments and political figures have been exposed in these child sex abuse rings. Investigations are proving decades of just horrific things done to these little ones. Even Prince Andrew has been accused. What are your thoughts on this and what should be done to all guilty parties involved?
Dark Justice: I suppose… No one knows the extent of it because there’s just that many people out there who don’t actually come out and say ‘oh we’re paedophiles’ or ‘we’re interested in child porn’ or whatever. So no one knows, not even the police don’t know the extent of what this could be.
SC: From What we can gather, it is pretty deep. Like world-wide and has been around for thousands of years. Seeing groups like yours that basically go out on your own and try and make some kind of impact. Do you know of any other groups in the UK that do something like this?
Dark Justice: Yeah we do know other groups such as Stinson Hunter and LetzGo Hunting and Online Paedophile Investigation Team.
SC: What kind of challenges do you think is preventing police services from investigating and convicting a lot of these creeps?
Dark Justice: From them doing it? Investigations like us or? Basically they can’t do an investigation like us because they are very clipped and it would a lot of time to apply for funding. And loop holes and what not to get that funding.
SC: So definitely some red tape type of thing.
Dark Justice: Yeah then the red tape so basically it just takes a lot of time to set up an investigation, we can do it in two minutes because we’re not bound by red tape.
SC: Now I want to bring up something that is kind of controversial. The definition of a paedophile is someone who is sexually attracted to prepubescent children, aged 12 and below. Do you think it’s equally criminal for a grown man to try and have sexual contact with a 14 year old… as lets say an 11 year old?
Dark Justice: I classify paedophiles as anyone who, I know it’s quite controversial to say it but, I’d class a paedophile as anyone who’s going for anyone who’s 15 below.
SC: I bring that up because some people sound like apologists, in a sense. I can understand a little bit, the person might be 18 with a 15-year-old, that’s kind of debatable. But generally speaking we’re talking about people who are 40 plus that are going for these kids really.
Dark Justice: Yeah.
SC: Generally when you do your work what’s the full process? How long does it usually take from one of these paedophiles contact you to, you have the confrontation?
Dark Justice: Well with Roger the one, what your website posted the other day, Sick Chirpse. It took of course about three to seven days to get him to meet – well he suggested the meeting and we just took control of the meet and where we wanted to meet. Well like a public area obviously so we could be safe. Then it took about three to seven days say ‘hey I want to meet’ and something like that.
SC: How long have you all been doing this?
Dark Justice: We will be doing it since October – we stopped there for a while because of family life and what not. Then we just got back into it because we have the time to fully dedicate ourselves to this.
SC: Have you ever been in a situation where one of these sex predators have become violent and you felt threatened?
Dark Justice: Fortunately not yet. But I suppose it will happen in the near future, not too sure.
SC: Have any of the people you’ve confronted look like they had any intention of abduction?
Dark Justice: Roger was kind of a weird one because what the police didn’t know was that he actually slept in his car for 12 hours plus to meet this girl. Then he wanted the girl to come to his car and basically just get in and drive away sort of thing. He slept in his car from 9 at night ‘til 9 in the morning because it was raining and stuff. And our team went standing about in the rain because no where was open at that time of night, just standing there trying to keep shelter.
Dark Justice: That tells you that he had a massive intention on actually abusing the girl I mean it’s just… sick.
SC: Oh absolutely! I can’t even imagine. You know for me personally I usually just – I’m in the comfort of my office and I usually just write but, to be actually out there when – interacting with these people who have this intention of malice is just… I mean big ups to you guys. Definitely.
Dark Justice: Yeah. Thank you.
SC: What are your plans for the future? Do you see yourselves expanding to other areas in the UK, maybe abroad?
Dark Justice: I’m not to sure about the future. I think it’s just all about getting these kind of people off the streets and just continuing, pushing, [unclear] get the parents to check the child’s phones and what not.
SC: If that’s not a super hero response, I don’t know what is to be honest. All jokes aside though, what you guys are doing is just amazing. I wish more people would take an interest in this.
Dark Justice: Yeah. A lot of people probably couldn’t put up with these sort people. I think that’s why they haven’t done it. Because a lot of them out there are arrogant and stuff like that and when you do meet them they’re like ‘oh well, nothing was going to happen. This wasn’t going to happen.’ But we’ve heard that bullshit like over and over again.
SC: We’ve seen shows like MSNBC’s “To Catch A Predator” and you know ‘Oh! I didn’t bring these condoms for the child… I just always keep them with me.’
Dark Justice: ‘It was just in my wallet.’ [laughs]
SC: [laughs] So we know they’re full of crap so… [pause] Any final thoughts, statements, more into what you do or?
Dark Justice: We have another court case coming up soon which we should have another video out for. Once we get the conviction we just put a video out and basically do what we did with Roger, expose him. Hopefully that court case goes well and we get a conviction.
SC: That’s interesting, the court thing. You basically wait for these guys to initiate something and you take it all the way to conviction?
DJ- Yeah. All the way to court.
SC: I don’t think I have ever heard of a group that actually does that.
Dark Justice: Yeah. Once that persons been arrested and said he’s guilty in court then we can drop the video whenever.
SC: Okay. ‘Cause he’s basically admitted it and all that.
Dark Justice: Yeah. Talking about Roger, the sentence was a bit lenient on Roger’s case but what can you do? If the sexual offences back in 2003 was in, when he committed the crime of impregnating a 12 year old girl, I think he would have gotten life on that there. He would have gotten life imprisonment when he went to court for trying to meet a 14-year-old girl.
SC: In that particular case that guy travelled what? 400 miles or something?
Dark Justice: 315 I think but, he done a round trip and he tried to basically go down south, but the police caught him because they sent a nationwide search out because he threatened to commit suicide. Fortunately the cop caught him in time and they arrested him and we just got to take out hats off to the police for getting there in time and arresting this [unclear phrase] off the streets.
SC: Tying this all together, do you think there’s more room for this type of work in the future, like citizens going out and kind of taking the initiative?
Dark Justice: I wouldn’t really suggest it if you don’t know the law side of things because one little step out the law and just cause you go to get prosecuted or whatever.
SC: You don’t want an angry hot head type of person who’s going to go beat him up. You want someone who’s responsible if they’re gonna do it.
Dark Justice: Yeah responsible. Know the laws and know what kind of people you’re dealing with. Because Roger actually admitted that he fingered a 12-year-old girl, got her… impregnated her which I don’t think a lot of people could deal with getting pulled out of someone then meeting them face to face. Let’s just say the least.
SC: No, I definitely think most people would be VIOLENTLY angry, to say the least.
Dark Justice: Yeah, certainly.
SC: Final thoughts?
Dark Justice: Final thoughts? I don’t know, just keep watching out for more of our videos and updates and what we have in the near future. We’re gonna keep pushing ‘til we get change.
SC: Well on that, are you seeking any public actions to get laws changed or policies changed?
Dark Justice: We are kind of looking into to doing something to get the law changed and get it looked at ‘cause I don’t know if you’ve heard of the High Group. If you’d Google them or look them up, basically it’s a paedophile exchange group. Basically years ago and years ago they were getting funding off the government and everything. They were making sick magazines for other paedophiles. Basically about children. I don’t how to describe what was in the magazines but it was absolutely disgusting. I’ve never looked at them but I seen little snippets in movies and what not. What I’ve seen from them is absolutely disgusting what they [Unclear name] were doing at the time and someone in that group suggested to judges what kind of sentences to give to these sort of people. Whether it’s prison, suspended sentences, and what not.
SC: So basically light sentences.
Dark Justice: Yeah, so basically getting paedophiles lenient sentences. These paedophiles were suggesting to judges saying ‘you should give them this, you should give them that.’ Which is absolutely disgusting.
SC: Anonymous has an operation ongoing which they call “Operation Death Eaters” and they’re basically trying to expose high level corruption in regards to these paedophile rings. What’s your official position on Anonymous and do you think they’re serving a good purpose in trying to do this?
Dark Justice: They’re controversial. It’s a really controversial one in Anonymous because some people like them, some people don’t. As far as exposing corruption it’s a brilliant idea because no one else would have the [unclear word] and expose these kind of people. I hope it goes successful really.
SC: We wish you all the best of luck in getting these predators behind bars. Thanks again for speaking with us.
Dark Justice: Not a problem. Thank you for speaking to us as well.